IVP’s Eric Liaw talks Klarna controversy, sticky successions, and why the nice valuation reset would not actually matter


When IVP lately introduced the closing of its 18th fund, I referred to as Eric Liaw, a longtime normal accomplice with the growth-stage agency, to ask a number of questions. For starters, wringing $1.6 billion in capital commitments from its traders proper now would appear much more difficult than garnering commitments through the frothier days of 2021, when IVP introduced a $1.8 billion automobile.

I additionally puzzled about succession at IVP, whose many bets embrace Figma and Robinhood, and whose founder and earlier traders nonetheless loom massive on the agency – each figuratively and actually. A current Fortune story famous that footage of agency founder Reid Dennis stay scattered “in all kinds of locations all through IVP’s San Francisco workplace.” In the meantime, footage of Todd Chaffee, Norm Fogelsong and Sandy Miller – former normal companions who are actually “advisory companions” – are combined in with the agency’s normal companions on the agency’s web site, which, visually no less than, makes much less room for the present technology.

Not final, I needed to speak with Liaw about Klarna, a portfolio firm that made headlines final month when a behind-the-scenes disagreement over who ought to sit on its board spilled into public view. Under are elements of our chat, edited for size and readability. You possibly can hearken to the longer dialog as a podcast right here.

Congratulations in your new fund. Now you possibly can chill out for a few months! Was the fundraising course of any kind of tough this time given the market?

It’s actually been a uneven interval all through. For those who actually rewind the clock, again in 2018 once we raised our sixteenth fund, it was a “regular” setting. We raised a barely larger one in 2021, which was not a standard setting. One factor we’re glad we didn’t do was increase an extreme quantity of capital relative to our technique, after which deploy all of it in a short time, which folks in our trade did. So [we’ve been] fairly constant.

Did you are taking any cash from Saudi Arabia? Doing so has develop into extra acceptable, extra widespread. I’m questioning if [Public Investment Fund] is a brand new or current LP. 

We don’t usually touch upon our LP base, however we don’t have capital from that area.

Talking of areas, you had been within the Bay Space for years. You could have two levels from Stanford. You’re now in London. When and why did you make that transfer?

We moved about eight months in the past. I’ve really been within the Bay Space since I used to be 18, once I got here to Stanford for undergrad. That’s extra years in the past than I care to confess at this level. However for us, growth to Europe was an natural extension of a technique we’ve been pursuing. We made our first funding in Europe again in 2006, in Helsinki, Finland, in an organization referred to as MySQL that was acquired subsequently by Solar [Microsystems] for a billion {dollars} when that was not run of the mill. Then, in 2013, we invested in Supercell, which can be based mostly in Finland. In 2014, we turned an investor in Klarna. And [at this point], our European portfolio at present is about 20 firms or so; it’s about 20% of our lively portfolio, unfold over 10 totally different international locations. We felt like placing some ft on the bottom was the suitable transfer.

There was quite a lot of drama round Klarna. What did you make of The Data’s experiences about [former Sequoia investor] Michael Moritz versus [Matt Miller], the Sequoia accomplice who was extra lately representing the agency and has since been changed by one other Sequoia accomplice, Andrew Reed?

We’re smaller traders in Klarna. We aren’t lively within the board discussions. We’re enthusiastic about their enterprise efficiency. In some ways, they’ve had the worst of each worlds. They file publicly. They’re topic to quite a lot of scrutiny. Everybody sees their numbers, however they don’t have the forex [i.e. that a publicly traded company enjoys]. I feel [CEO and co-founder] Sebastian [Siemiatkowski] is now far more open about the truth that they’ll be a public entity in some unspecified time in the future within the not-too-distant future, which we’re enthusiastic about. The reporting, I suppose if correct, I can’t get behind the motivations. I don’t know precisely what occurred. I’m simply glad that he put it behind them and may deal with the enterprise.

You and I’ve talked about totally different international locations and a few of their respective strengths. We’ve talked about client startups. It brings to thoughts the social community BeReal in France, which is reportedly in search of Collection C funding proper now or else it would possibly promote. Has IVP kicked the tires on that firm?

We’ve researched them and spoken to them up to now and we aren’t presently an investor, so I don’t have quite a lot of visibility into what their present technique is. I feel social is tough; the prize is very large, however the path to get there’s fairly arduous. I do assume each few years, firms are capable of set up a foothold even with the power of Fb-slash-Meta. Snap continues to have a powerful pull; we invested in Snap fairly early on. Discord has carved out some house available in the market for themselves. Clearly, TikTok has achieved one thing fairly transformational around the globe. So the prize is large nevertheless it’s arduous to get there. That’s a part of the problem of the fund, investing in client apps, which we’ve achieved, [figuring out] which of those rocket ships has sufficient gasoline to interrupt via the ambiance and which can come again right down to earth,

Relating to your new fund, that Fortune story famous that the agency isn’t named after founder Reid Dennis as proof that it was constructed to survive him. But it additionally famous there are footage of Dennis all over the place, and others of the agency’s previous companions, and now advisors, are very prominently featured on IVP’s web site. IVP talks about making room for youthful companions; I do marvel if that’s really taking place. 

I might say with out query, it’s taking place. We’ve a powerful tradition and custom of offering folks of their careers the chance to maneuver up within the group to the best echelons of the final partnership. I’m lucky to be an instance of that. Lots of my companions are, as properly. It’s not completely the trail on the agency, nevertheless it’s an actual alternative that folks have.

We don’t have a managing accomplice or we don’t have a CEO. We’ve had folks enter the agency, serve the agency and our LPs, and likewise as they get to a special level of their lives and careers, take a step again and transfer on to various things, which by definition does create extra room and accountability for people who find themselves youthful and now are reaching that prime age of their careers to assist carry the establishment ahead.

Can I ask: do these advisors nonetheless obtain carry?

You possibly can ask, however I don’t need to get into economics or issues alongside that dimension. So I’ll quietly decline [that question]. However we do worth their inputs and recommendation and their contributions to the agency over a few years.

There’s clearly a valuation reset happening for each firm seemingly that’s not a big language mannequin firm, which is quite a lot of firms. I’d guess that offers you simpler entry to prime firms, but additionally hurts a few of your current portfolio firms. How is the agency navigating via all of it?

I feel when it comes to firms which might be elevating cash, those which might be most promising will at all times have a selection, and there’ll at all times be competitors for these rounds and thus these rounds and the valuations related to them will at all times really feel costly. I don’t assume anybody has ever reached an important enterprise consequence feeling like, ‘Man, I acquired a steal on that deal.’ You at all times really feel barely uncomfortable. However the perception in what the corporate can develop into offsets that feeling of discomfort. That’s a part of the enjoyable of the job.